Mariano might be useless.

Mariano is far and away my favorite player of all time. And obviously the best closer of all-time. But the games meta in years past does not really fit him well. Most players hit the FB well. An in and out cutter might be a ok pitch depending on the movement. But how fast will fast be? And how much movement exactly we have to see.

I hope he’s usable. I’ll take him on a gamble day 1 since I’m getting two diamond variety packs.

Only way for him to truly be effective is for SDS to overhaul the cutter entirely. Late, rapid movement is all that can save it.

@A_PerfectGame said in Mariano might be useless.:

Mariano is far and away my favorite player of all time. And obviously the best closer of all-time. But the games meta in years past does not really fit him well. Most players hit the FB well. An in and out cutter might be a ok pitch depending on the movement. But how fast will fast be? And how much movement exactly we have to see.

I hope he’s usable. I’ll take him on a gamble day 1 since I’m getting two diamond variety packs.

From what SDS said in one of there streams pitchers with a dominant pitch will have a quirk. I think its called outliner
Makes fastball faster, cutters cut more etc. So I think he'll be fine.

Outlier quirk is what they called it.

@CHI-TOWN-WONDER said in Mariano might be useless.:

@A_PerfectGame said in Mariano might be useless.:

Mariano is far and away my favorite player of all time. And obviously the best closer of all-time. But the games meta in years past does not really fit him well. Most players hit the FB well. An in and out cutter might be a ok pitch depending on the movement. But how fast will fast be? And how much movement exactly we have to see.

I hope he’s usable. I’ll take him on a gamble day 1 since I’m getting two diamond variety packs.

From what SDS said in one of there streams pitchers with a dominant pitch will have a quirk. I think its called outliner
Makes fastball faster, cutters cut more etc. So I think he'll be fine.

I’m 90% sure it only makes pitches faster. The first examples they gave for the outlier quirk were Syndergaard and Jordan Hicks 100+ sinkers

kenley jansen also throws cutters 95% of the time in real life

@daywokker said in Mariano might be useless.:

kenley jansen also throws cutters 95% of the time in real life

Yep and he's one of my best RP (with Wade Davis). Against LH hitters, i prefer to go with Jansen rather than LHP.

@CHI-TOWN-WONDER said in Mariano might be useless.:

From what SDS said in one of there streams pitchers with a dominant pitch will have a quirk. I think its called outliner
Makes fastball faster, cutters cut more etc. So I think he'll be fine.

That quirk is only for guys that regularly top 100 on the gun. I don't think Rivera will have that, but I do think they make his cutter nasty.

The cutter that doesn’t cut (like you think it will) gets destroyed. So being that the cutter was Marianos primary pitch, I hope they did something to it or he will not be as good as people think.

He also came up throwing a FB, 2SFB, Slider, Changeup, Cutter. When he began his career he threw those pitches and then realized he only needed to perfect the cutter to be lethal. So technically he could be given other pitches but it is very doubtful.

I agree with every point but one. Clearly the greatest closer of all time is Shawn Chacon

There is some data showing that he did throw a slider and changeup at different points of his career, so they will probably implement that into his variety of cards throughout the year

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/mariano-rivera/844/stats#pitch-type

To make him play realistically, they need to have it programmed realistically. Do not give him pitches he did not throw. Program the game to where it is harder for the batter you are controlling to make good contact with the ball. This has always been the problem with zone hitting. Just bc the user can identify the cutter and it’s location, does not mean the batter you are controlling can.

Mo is hard to get right on a game. I remember facing him on ASB 2005. It was all cutters all the time, place the PCI right at the point it was going to break to and unload.

@A_PerfectGame said in Mariano might be useless.:

Mariano is far and away my favorite player of all time. And obviously the best closer of all-time. But the games meta in years past does not really fit him well. Most players hit the FB well. An in and out cutter might be a ok pitch depending on the movement. But how fast will fast be? And how much movement exactly we have to see.

I hope he’s usable. I’ll take him on a gamble day 1 since I’m getting two diamond variety packs.

Maybe add a quirk for an outlier movement and have that much tougher to hit cutter... Rivera had the nastiest cutter of all time

@sean_87_ said in Mariano might be useless.:

To make him play realistically, they need to have it programmed realistically. Do not give him pitches he did not throw. Program the game to where it is harder for the batter you are controlling to make good contact with the ball. This has always been the problem with zone hitting. Just bc the user can identify the cutter and it’s location, does not mean the batter you are controlling can.

Why even have the controller in your hand then?

They will give Rivera at least a changeup and a complementary hard 4SFB. And that cutter will have HUGE break. Evidence is what they've done with Zack Britton. When he was having his insanely dominant years with the O's he threw something like 97% sinkers at 96-98. SDS gave him something more like his old starter repertoire.

@saintsfan_1029 said in Mariano might be useless.:

@sean_87_ said in Mariano might be useless.:

To make him play realistically, they need to have it programmed realistically. Do not give him pitches he did not throw. Program the game to where it is harder for the batter you are controlling to make good contact with the ball. This has always been the problem with zone hitting. Just bc the user can identify the cutter and it’s location, does not mean the batter you are controlling can.

Why even have the controller in your hand then?

You miss the point. For the game to be realistic every player must feel unique and play to their real life counterparts. If players are not properly represented in the game than there is no point to ever upgrading your team or getting excited about new players bc it wouldn’t matter. When you have too much user input, the game cannot appropriately represent each player in a realistic fashion. For example, a pitchers fastball. Of course the user can see it, but to represent the actual sport of baseball and the players you are controlling, outcomes need to be determined more heavily on the players actual abilities. User input should all be about decision making with individual players abilities. A lot of players struggled against marionas fastball, that needs to be represented in the game.

@sean_87_ said in Mariano might be useless.:

@saintsfan_1029 said in Mariano might be useless.:

@sean_87_ said in Mariano might be useless.:

To make him play realistically, they need to have it programmed realistically. Do not give him pitches he did not throw. Program the game to where it is harder for the batter you are controlling to make good contact with the ball. This has always been the problem with zone hitting. Just bc the user can identify the cutter and it’s location, does not mean the batter you are controlling can.

Why even have the controller in your hand then?

You miss the point. For the game to be realistic every player must feel unique and play to their real life counterparts. If players are not properly represented in the game than there is no point to ever upgrading your team or getting excited about new players bc it wouldn’t matter. When you have too much user input, the game cannot appropriately represent each player in a realistic fashion. For example, a pitchers fastball. Of course the user can see it, but to represent the actual sport of baseball and the players you are controlling, outcomes need to be determined more heavily on the players actual abilities. User input should all be about decision making with individual players abilities. A lot of players struggled against marionas fastball, that needs to be represented in the game.

I think the game should be 90% user input. I feel like the last few years it’s been about 60% which leaves to way too much chance.

@sean_87_ said in Mariano might be useless.:

@saintsfan_1029 said in Mariano might be useless.:

@sean_87_ said in Mariano might be useless.:

To make him play realistically, they need to have it programmed realistically. Do not give him pitches he did not throw. Program the game to where it is harder for the batter you are controlling to make good contact with the ball. This has always been the problem with zone hitting. Just bc the user can identify the cutter and it’s location, does not mean the batter you are controlling can.

Why even have the controller in your hand then?

You miss the point. For the game to be realistic every player must feel unique and play to their real life counterparts. If players are not properly represented in the game than there is no point to ever upgrading your team or getting excited about new players bc it wouldn’t matter. When you have too much user input, the game cannot appropriately represent each player in a realistic fashion. For example, a pitchers fastball. Of course the user can see it, but to represent the actual sport of baseball and the players you are controlling, outcomes need to be determined more heavily on the players actual abilities. User input should all be about decision making with individual players abilities. A lot of players struggled against marionas fastball, that needs to be represented in the game.

I didn’t miss the point. Stats matter in other ways that make it more difficult or easier for the user. Stats don’t and shouldn’t place the PCI on the ball with good timing. That’s the users job

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